James Chau, president of the China-United States Exchange Foundation, is on Straight Talk this week. He explains how US-China relations can move forward amid major changes in US political leadership. He also says that a forum this Friday can help figure out a better way forward.
Check out the full transcript of TVB’s Straight Talk host Dr Eugene Chan’s interview with James Chau:
Chan: Good evening, and welcome to Straight Talk. I'm Eugene Chan. Our guest this evening is President of the China-United States Exchange Foundation, James Chau. As a London King's College and Cambridge University graduate, Chau began his career as a journalist and later became a news anchor in Hong Kong and Beijing. He is known for his interviews with Nobel laureates and other prominent figures such as Jimmy Carter, Aung San Suu Kyi and Bill Gates. James is also a World Economic Forum Young Global Leader and the World Health Organization Goodwill Ambassador. Welcome, James, to the show!
Chau: Thank you very much, Eugene! It's a joy to be with you.
Chan: We're very happy to have you here, because the whole world has been eyeing on this US election that happened last week. We have been having a great anticipation of results, and we know that has been a very eventful lead-up, because we saw a last minute change in the candidate for the Democratic Party, from Biden to Kamala Harris, and then we saw two assassination attempts on Donald Trump. Now, as we know, Donald Trump has made the president-elect, he made a historical comeback. And if you look at the statistics, he got half, over half of the popular votes, secured over 300 electoral college votes, and even won the Senate, close to getting the House of Representatives. We also heard that the Supreme Court is also his sort of colleague. So, a very strong government is to come. Did anybody expect this? Were all the predictions that there was a very close tie, was it wrong?
Chau: Well, Eugene, I think you know, if you look back, say to the last 12 months, and as you said, this election has been particularly anticipated. Everyone had their different views and, you know, I think ultimately from where we sit in between the United States and China and what they do, it's always been about, you know, what the American people are going to decide, what the issues are that will be most urgent for them. And I think quite clearly, the economy has emerged as that top single issue that they want a better life. They want to have the ability to plan financially. They want to feel that they're part of this mainstream economy. So, we have and we are in a world where the gap between the rich and the poor seems only to be getting wider and deeper. I think the American people, like everyone else in the world, want to make sure that they can participate in the benefits of the mainstream economy that surrounds them.
Chan: Right. So, this kind of, what I mean, I can say sort of one side of the victory. What does that tell us? I mean, I don't think there'll be any protests or any election results, because we read in the news that President Joe Biden and also Kamala Harris have actually conceded the defeat to President-Elect Trump. So, something new, at least we can move on. But why these one-sided results?
Chau: I think again, you know, I think if you put it in the context of the world, which is where we see it being based here in Hong Kong. The world is changing. I mean, I know change is the constant condition of the world in itself. So, change in itself is not extraordinary, but the types of changes and the years leading up to this election, I think, very much shaped the results that we see. We've come out of an extraordinary, once in a lifetime health event being the COVID-19 pandemic, the cost of living crisis, the energy, the food bills, the transport bills that people are so concerned about. And I think in a sense, there's been a build up to this outcome which is, if you look at it, it all ties in together, rather than being detached from the global events and national and local events that people are concerned about. So, I think this, also, as you said earlier, has been an extraordinary election. I mean, when in our lifetime have we seen a new candidate emerge in the period of, say, July, she had a very short runway period to the election, and I think the Democrats are already reflecting in words on what that meant for their ability to win an election. All this money went into it, and she didn't win. It's always going to be disappointing and perhaps surprising to the losing side, but she did have a very, very short run up to position herself as the candidate that wasn't a primary within the Democrats as well, but I think they'll be reflecting on that. As you said, it is a pretty convincing win, and I think it gives him the mandate to move quite clearly forward as well.
Chan: So, just now, I think you mentioned a very good statement that we will be, I think, the result would be good indicator of what the American people want, because usually, if you want to do any predictions, age and past history and track record will be a very good sort of indicator of whether you vote for that person. But Donald Trump definitely is the older candidate. He has been impeached by the Congress during his presidency, he's also the only American president to be indicted on criminal charges, and the American people still vote for him. He must be representing something that American people want. What would that be?
Chau: Well, he did have a, you know, a four year try-out, so to speak, and the eyes of the voters, so they know what they're going to get and what they feel they're going to get, is a person who comes from business. I mean, he's not a career politician, he's not a career diplomat; he is a business leader who has had great success during points of his career. And I think they're looking for someone to try to get the economy back on track in their eyes, at least for those who voted for him. But I would also say this, that had Vice President Harris won the election, and really simply by standing for this election, she created multiple firsts of her own. I mean, we have a woman running for the highest office in the land, only Secretary Hillary Clinton had done that before, and that was already some time ago. She's Black Caribbean, and also from her mother, South Asian, from India. So, on multiple levels, she created a number of firsts. And so I think while there is this inward reflection now within the party, I think there's so much that everybody can take, not just Democrats and Republicans, but as Americans about how strong their democratic institutions are, that you could have someone who's been vice president and who now ran for president, I think there's a lot to be taken from that. And you know, the American democratic or democracy model runs on inspiration as well as examples and models. And I think they both provided that in some ways, she, as a woman of color, a distinguished public prosecutor from the California area. And Trump is, you know, he was so well-known even before he became president the first time around. He's a real personality.
Chan: And actually when I was preparing for the interview with you, I just sort of shortlisted the things that he had promised during the campaign. He said he will fix the economy, cut the taxes, and deport all the illegal immigrants. He even promised to end the Ukraine conflict. Is this what the American people want?
Chau: I think people want peace…
Chan: Exactly.
Chau: ... and that's not so different from the Chinese message. One of the first public signals after his victory came out is that they want a relationship that continues to be guided by a number of principles that have always guided US-China relations and living in peaceful coexistence, or, let's just say, getting along. It's not a bad thing at all. The Ukraine conflict, the war in the Middle East, not even counting the multiple other conflicts don't make it to our headlines in Yemen, in Syria and elsewhere. I mean loss of life. Loss of life and human suffering is devastating for people everywhere. I do think that we're looking for a reset in the world, whether it be through the US elections or otherwise. I think people are tired of loss. I mean, I mentioned there the COVID-19 pandemic. That was a war within our homes where people died, we lost valuable leaders and members of our community getting along in peace and preserving human life is a pretty good thing, I would say.
Chan: Right. So, James, let's move on to the impact on the US-China relations. The world has been very chaotic at the moment, with all the geopolitics front and center of all global discussions and policy making, and of course, the most relevant to us is the US-China relations. That being said, this year actually marked the 45th anniversary of the United States and China's decision to normalize relations. How do you believe this recent US election results under the Trump administration will reshape the US-China relations?
Chau: I'm going to say it's too early to say because we are in November. There's a critical runway period to the inauguration in January, these couple of weeks are absolutely important. It's not about sitting back and reacting to whatever occurred in Washington. The US and China, the key actors within this US-China relationship, must use this window of time to stabilize or further stabilize the relationship, or else you will have the new cabinet, the new president coming in, in January. And we don't want to start off on the wrong foot. There needs to be a supportive narrative and some of the infrastructure in place. The best I think one could hope for is a calm, communicative environment, so that when day one comes, they're ready to go, they're in place, in the office. But Eugene, I want to go back to this question, so I don't want to skirt the question that you asked me about what the American people want. I think they pretty much want the same thing as Chinese people. You look at Americans and they have this beautiful idea of the American Dream, which is actually quite magical. The fact that you want your generation after you to do better than your own is also intrinsic to Chinese culture. If you think about your dad. We were talking about our fathers before coming on set, they wanted us to do better than them. You're a father of two children. You want your children to do even better than you've achieved in your career. And if you look at American psychology, this whole idea of doing well, they tell people, we came to this country with $50 in our pocket. We came to this country and now I'm the first person in my family to go to college. That is a milestone, that is a mark of achievement, a record of success. And so I think they want what Chinese people want. They want what most people want, which is the ability to live their best life, access to health services, and education. They want to be able to live in a place where there's clean air, where their children can go out and play without being in fear of being kidnapped or other threats. We want to live in a risk-free and a threat-free world.
Chan: So, James, maybe that's Donald Trump's election slogan, or make the USA great again. So, it summarizes all that well. Maybe … let's take a break now, and viewers, stay with us. We will be right back.
Chan: Thank you for staying with us. James Chau, president of the China-United States Exchange Foundation, is our guest this evening. And we have been talking about the impact of the recent US elections. What can we expect from the second Trump administration? So, James, we had touched on the background of the election, what the American people might want. And you mentioned a very important point that the next two months to lead up to the Trump administration is something that we have to watch out for as well. I just realized that President Joe Biden and the President Xi Jinping met last November for the first time in a year to welcome outcomes on the economic, military and AI issues. President Xi said China is ready to be a partner and friend of the US. And President Biden confirmed that we are back to a direct, open, and clear communications on a direct basis. So, both presidents will be in South America next week for the annual APEC and G20 meetings before Trump is going to inaugurate on Jan 20, 2025. What can we expect from this since you mentioned the next two months will be very important?
Chau: That is interesting timing, Eugene. I think there is going to be the acknowledgement that this is an outgoing administration but one, through Kamala Harris and Joe Biden has promised or has said to president-elect Trump that they are going to ensure a smooth transfer of power. So, the transition process, as you just mentioned, is very important. But certainly, I think all actors in the US-China relationship will be looking forward to the next administration. They are the ones who are going to be informing and shaping and deciding public policy, including where it pertains to the US-China relationship. So, I would expect that when they do meet again with just a couple of weeks before the transition, it will be a kind of a “thank you” and what kind of heads-up could they expect. But also it will be an acknowledgement that they are not going to be the ones in power in a few weeks’ time, nor in the next four years. So, I think it is going to be rather along those lines as well. But US administrations come and go very quickly. There is an election process every four years, and it is almost six months after the election, they go back into campaigning mode for the midterms, and then the elections again after that.
Chan: Yes.
Chau: And you never know who is going to come in in four years, whether it's Republican, whether it's going to be Democratic. So, it is always about covering your bases and always understanding who are the individuals and the parties within that, who are emerging at the same time. So, constantly keeping in touch and staying friends with all Americans because you know, Americans, whether they be Democrats or Republicans, they are Americans. And all Americans are human beings, like everybody else in the world. I think what we lack, partly robbed by COVID-19, is that human contact.
Chan: Indeed.
Chau: And you just find that when people get together in a room, it is a lot easier.
Chan: Right. Many world leaders have sent congratulatory messages to the president-elect, Donald Trump, including our Xi Jinping. He said, “It is hoped that the two sides will uphold the principles of mutual respect, peaceful coexistence, and the win-win cooperation, and find the correct way for China and the US to get along.” So, do you think this sort of set the scene that, as the title of tonight's show is, “What is its Impact on Hong Kong?” Do you think we are going to have more dialogue and more cooperation between the two main countries?
Chau: We will and we have had, especially in the last year plus. You mentioned that the construction of the San Francisco Vision at APEC 12 months ago, that was a key moment. But that was built on months and months of high-level cabinet visits from both sides, particularly from the American side to China, and also from the Chinese side later on to the US. So, I think that that momentum will continue. Of course, you remember that the US State Department and other agencies, or the US government are not necessarily as affected by the change in the White House. That is one thing. The second thing is that there is, I believe, a momentum that will not stop. The relationship is stabilized, but is not yet stable. So, there is still quite a lot of work still to be achieved. And going back to the three principles you mentioned there, which is respect, peace, and a win-win cooperation for all.
Chan: Indeed.
Chau: I think the key word here is peace. How do we get to live alongside each other in peace? You mentioned that Ukraine conflict, which is a key component of that. And where I am concerned is that you see the US moving on one train track and, you see, China moving another train track. And those two train tracks, over the years, have become increasingly parallel to each other, rather than together. You look at social media, we have separate platforms in China, there is separate platforms in the US. The problem with that is that they are both in existence, both are in reality, but they are going along, they are side by side, but not necessarily together. My great concern is that the destination is conflict, when you keep on having these train tracks separate to each other. And unless the Americans and Chinese are absolutely okay with reaching that mutual point of conflict, then you have to actually start doing something now. The way you do it is find a shard of light, a glimmer of light somewhere. And where you can do it, you go in and you seize it quickly, and you pounce on it, and you create something different. Carter did it with Brzezinski and Deng Xiaoping in 1979; Dr Kissinger doing it with Chairman Mao, did it in 1971 and 1972. You need to find that tiny area where you could work on with each other and pounce on it, and don't let that opportunity pass. And I think they have to do that very keenly. CUSEF, as a non-governmental organization that isn't burdened with the responsibilities of state, being an NGO, is very good at doing that, finding those opportunities and getting people moving on that.
Chan: James, as an executive, which I am sure is going to bring onto your point, just now when you mentioned that the two train tracks, I think we still remember the word “globalization”, we want to work together. Now we are back to regionalization, I don't think it is beneficial to any party, especially if the endpoint could mean conflict. So, let's hope that we work something out. And since you mentioned, your CUSEF, the China-United States Exchange Foundation, which is a non-profit organization founded by our honorable Tung Chee-hwa, our first chief executive, and have been working very hard for Hong Kong for the last 16 years. And I believe you will be holding an actual forum on the coming Friday, and that will be the first bilateral meeting anywhere in the world since the election. Can you tell us what are your outcomes? Is it exactly what you are trying to achieve, as you just mentioned, making sure that both sides will talk and this is used as a golden opportunity that we will make ends meet together?
Chau: So, the dialogue is important, but it is a working meeting, rather than a talking meeting. We are calling it ‘reflection and forecasts’ in recognition of the multiple anniversaries: 45 years since normalization, one year since San Francisco, 10 days since the US election. But we are going to try and pivot that much more to the forecasting than just the reflecting. And we have incredible people who will be with us in the room to do just that. Everyone from the Vice Minister of the CPC Central Committee Lu Kang and Charlene Barshefsky, a democrat who was US trade representative, now chair of the National Committee on US-China Relations. We also have representatives of three US presidential families – Nixon, Carter, and Bush. So, it is an extraordinary line-up of people. Together with the right people on the Chinese side, being people like I mentioned, Vice Minister Lu Kang, Chairman Bi Jingquan, and two former vice foreign ministers of China, Ambassador Cui Tiankai and Ambassador Zhou Wenzhong, and Yang Jienmian. Why it is important is that we are putting them together with actors from third countries, India, Chile, Colombia, the Netherlands, the UK, Australia, Germany, Indonesia, because we do need the clarity of third countries that can see things more clearly than we can, but have the trust of both sides and a little bit more neutral to get us back together. So, the outcomes, I think, will be trying to create that environment of respect, so we can work together towards an outcome of peace. But ultimately do so in a way that the US and China don't come out on top of each other, but rather actually progress with each other. I know that may be a very kind of challenging concept for some people to accept, that both people can win and both sides need not be locked in competition going forward, but it is absolutely doable. And we look back to 1972 and 1979, they created a modern US-China relationship during the Cold War. What more of a challenging time could there be than that?
Chan: Right, James, since you mentioned that the forum is going to be coming Friday, it is going to be held in Hong Kong. Being a Hong Kong person, I am going to ask you, since we always position ourselves as a super connector and super enabler, what can we do to help, almost to help, to assist in building this trust? Is there anything there in Hong Kong to be a start of that?
Chau: First of all, as you and I are acutely aware, the Hong Kong people are talented people, sophisticated people, intellectual people, with a big vision. They are able to do exactly what they have done for over 100 years. You used the word super-connector, let's break that down. They are bilingual, but also they are multi-culturally fluid. They can interpret one side with the other, at a time when trust is absent, and at a time when communication is still too low to be effective and impactful in the long run. The Hong Kong people are also the architects of this incredible international city. And for so long we have been seen as a center for international finance and trade and commerce. Don't forget, we are also now a global city for arts and culture, which speaks to civilization. At the time when people are questioning their identity, but Hong Kong has always been the home and always the sanctuary for people seeking safety. Now in this time of uncertainty, we simply have to go back to what we are doing best, but to pivot in a way. I think we have forgotten in Hong Kong how good we are.
Chan: Yeah, James, I have to ask for a very brief answer because you have told us many things. One thing I want to ask is we have over 1,200 US firms here in Hong Kong, and over half of them are actually regional headquarters. How important is that presence to the US and China relationship?
Chau: Vitally. If you don't have America here, we are not quite the Hong Kong that we are.
Chan: That is exactly the answer I am sure we all want. So, thank you, James, for your insights into this complex area. You have reminded us of the importance of open dialogue and collaboration in this quickly changing landscape. And we hope that Hong Kong can use our unique position to foster understanding and cooperation between our country and the United States.
Thank you for joining us and have a good evening!
